Big fan of backup meals for my adult self. So many nights that I don't have the time or energy to cook a more involved meal, or I have leftovers to eat but they don't sound good. A perennial favorite is instant mashed potatoes because it's like science and then you have a big bowl of warmth. Backup meals are also a solid solution for me for when ED brain tries to barge back in, I guess same vibe as safe foods.
I forgot to copy+paste the exact quote but one or both of you talked about food rules and that hit home for me. I'm sooooooooo big on rules for everything, my partner loved to tease me about it. But I am realizing right this very second that rules can be fun! Instead of there being a rule that I have to eat leftovers before making something new, I can have a rule that I eat whatever sounds tastiest in that moment! And it being a rule means my silly brain can't argue with it. This is how I hack my brain and body into healing themselves, I guess.
I don't know, I'm not sure that the goal isn't a kid who isn't at least flexible on what they will eat. My kid will reject a dinner that he ate perfectly happily a month ago as "gross" simply because he was hoping I'd make spaghetti and meatballs that night instead, and I just hate the idea of rewarding my little white-man-in-training for reflexively rejecting anything that wasn't his personal idea. The thing is, he likes food and strong flavors. He just likes his expectations more.
A thing I am working on is separating out the real issues (and my parental anxieties) in play:
* Manners and appropriate table behavior (It's okay to not like something, it's not okay to be a jerk about it)
* Overall flexibility and openness, the understanding that the world does not in fact revolve around him
* Not insulting unfamiliar foods and cuisines that might be what your friends love to eat (calling this out separately from manners because it has inclusivity implications)
* Actual nutritional concerns (for example: at some point, you do actually need to be able to poop, so we need to find one or more agreeable ways for you to eat vegetables)
Here's what's working for us:
- You can eat the dinner or not eat the dinner, but you are not allowed to repetitively or dramatically complain about a non-preferred meal.
- I am open to requests about how to adjust a challenging meal's presentation to make it more approachable. You want your grilled salmon on a bun so you can have it as a sandwich? You got it, baby.
- Certain particular favorites are made on a predictable schedule so there is no question as to when they will be served again. We observe the sacred holidays of Taco Tuesday and Pizza Friday in this house.
I may try the "if you don't want this dinner you are welcome to make your own, but I am not getting up again" approach. I suspect a lot of PBJ in his future. :D
I agree, flexibility is a key goal and part of becoming an independent eater. But it will look different for different kids, and may feel pretty out of reach to a lot of kids at various points. 100% with you on the manners thing though. A big reason I offer the backup option early is because the at-the-table rejection was so unpleasant. We do a lot of modeling how to say "it's not my favorite" instead of "i hate it" when someone has prepared food, and make the labor of food preparation very visible to the kids so they understand and see it. And while I'd never enforce a consequence for not eating something (that's their choice), I have used consequences for rude behavior about not eating something.
I like how you framed this as modeling the thing you would prefer they say. When kids use language like “gross, I hate it,” it’s so natural to feel offended or worried about their future behavior in the world. But I don’t think they’re really being rude or selfish; they just don’t have the skills yet to articulate to themselves or to us, “Hmm this food is unfamiliar or unexpected, and I’m having some *feelings* about that, so I just want my favorite food.” We can act as kind of a translator for them, to notice and validate those feelings of discomfort or surprise, and still hold to whatever boundary we have set re: the food options available to them.
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
The advice to have the bedtime snack be sort of a backup meal is very much it for us. I think I've said a version of this before, but for my kid dinner is almost incidental. If it's something he really likes, great, he'll eat a bunch, but rather than try to eat at the early time that works for him, we give him a significant snack before dinner, and then he gets a significant bedtime snack. We do want him to sit at dinner with us at least for a while most nights (he gets one "rug night" a week, more if for instance my husband has a work call right at dinner), but the food component ranges from minimal to omg spaghetti and meatballs can I have seconds.
When one of you said, “the more you can remember that dinner is a time to be together, everyone may or may not eat the same thing, that's not really the end all be all goal here,” it brought to my mind going out to eat with loved ones. There’s no expectation that everyone eats the same meal. And still, it’s a marvelous time, perhaps even made better because everyone was able to choose a meal catered to their tastes and needs. On the other hand, it can be really fun to have the shared experience of a set menu and talk about what everyone enjoys and doesn’t. So, again: there’s no one right way for a group of people to eat and enjoy a meal!
Side note: My husband and I have a running joke about my needfor us to order different meals at a restaurant—I guess because I want us, collectively, to sample as many offerings as possible or to have the “full” experience? In the past, I have been know to override my own desire to order a particular thing because my husband already decided to order it, and I have wound up disappointed both in my second choice and for having missed out on what I really wanted. So that’s a weird food rule I just realized and want to unpack…
Yes! We don't question this at restaurants but at home, there's this expectation of sameness. Which makes sense from a labor perspective for sure, but not if it's making more work and stress for you.
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
Big fan of backup meals for my adult self. So many nights that I don't have the time or energy to cook a more involved meal, or I have leftovers to eat but they don't sound good. A perennial favorite is instant mashed potatoes because it's like science and then you have a big bowl of warmth. Backup meals are also a solid solution for me for when ED brain tries to barge back in, I guess same vibe as safe foods.
I forgot to copy+paste the exact quote but one or both of you talked about food rules and that hit home for me. I'm sooooooooo big on rules for everything, my partner loved to tease me about it. But I am realizing right this very second that rules can be fun! Instead of there being a rule that I have to eat leftovers before making something new, I can have a rule that I eat whatever sounds tastiest in that moment! And it being a rule means my silly brain can't argue with it. This is how I hack my brain and body into healing themselves, I guess.
A rule to eat whatever sounds tastiest in the moment is a GENIUS way to hack the need for food rules.
I don't know, I'm not sure that the goal isn't a kid who isn't at least flexible on what they will eat. My kid will reject a dinner that he ate perfectly happily a month ago as "gross" simply because he was hoping I'd make spaghetti and meatballs that night instead, and I just hate the idea of rewarding my little white-man-in-training for reflexively rejecting anything that wasn't his personal idea. The thing is, he likes food and strong flavors. He just likes his expectations more.
A thing I am working on is separating out the real issues (and my parental anxieties) in play:
* Manners and appropriate table behavior (It's okay to not like something, it's not okay to be a jerk about it)
* Overall flexibility and openness, the understanding that the world does not in fact revolve around him
* Not insulting unfamiliar foods and cuisines that might be what your friends love to eat (calling this out separately from manners because it has inclusivity implications)
* Actual nutritional concerns (for example: at some point, you do actually need to be able to poop, so we need to find one or more agreeable ways for you to eat vegetables)
Here's what's working for us:
- You can eat the dinner or not eat the dinner, but you are not allowed to repetitively or dramatically complain about a non-preferred meal.
- I am open to requests about how to adjust a challenging meal's presentation to make it more approachable. You want your grilled salmon on a bun so you can have it as a sandwich? You got it, baby.
- Certain particular favorites are made on a predictable schedule so there is no question as to when they will be served again. We observe the sacred holidays of Taco Tuesday and Pizza Friday in this house.
I may try the "if you don't want this dinner you are welcome to make your own, but I am not getting up again" approach. I suspect a lot of PBJ in his future. :D
I agree, flexibility is a key goal and part of becoming an independent eater. But it will look different for different kids, and may feel pretty out of reach to a lot of kids at various points. 100% with you on the manners thing though. A big reason I offer the backup option early is because the at-the-table rejection was so unpleasant. We do a lot of modeling how to say "it's not my favorite" instead of "i hate it" when someone has prepared food, and make the labor of food preparation very visible to the kids so they understand and see it. And while I'd never enforce a consequence for not eating something (that's their choice), I have used consequences for rude behavior about not eating something.
I like how you framed this as modeling the thing you would prefer they say. When kids use language like “gross, I hate it,” it’s so natural to feel offended or worried about their future behavior in the world. But I don’t think they’re really being rude or selfish; they just don’t have the skills yet to articulate to themselves or to us, “Hmm this food is unfamiliar or unexpected, and I’m having some *feelings* about that, so I just want my favorite food.” We can act as kind of a translator for them, to notice and validate those feelings of discomfort or surprise, and still hold to whatever boundary we have set re: the food options available to them.
Yes, great point. It’s not malicious! They are just overwhelmed and expressing that… and we can help them learn kinder ways to express their needs.
I chuckled at “white man in training” because I too think about that with one of my kids, though not so much about food.
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
YES. Dinner is rough when you're two. (Also, based on my kids, when you're four...)
The advice to have the bedtime snack be sort of a backup meal is very much it for us. I think I've said a version of this before, but for my kid dinner is almost incidental. If it's something he really likes, great, he'll eat a bunch, but rather than try to eat at the early time that works for him, we give him a significant snack before dinner, and then he gets a significant bedtime snack. We do want him to sit at dinner with us at least for a while most nights (he gets one "rug night" a week, more if for instance my husband has a work call right at dinner), but the food component ranges from minimal to omg spaghetti and meatballs can I have seconds.
This is A LOT where my kids are. It's so helpful to just identify and embrace that!
When one of you said, “the more you can remember that dinner is a time to be together, everyone may or may not eat the same thing, that's not really the end all be all goal here,” it brought to my mind going out to eat with loved ones. There’s no expectation that everyone eats the same meal. And still, it’s a marvelous time, perhaps even made better because everyone was able to choose a meal catered to their tastes and needs. On the other hand, it can be really fun to have the shared experience of a set menu and talk about what everyone enjoys and doesn’t. So, again: there’s no one right way for a group of people to eat and enjoy a meal!
Side note: My husband and I have a running joke about my needfor us to order different meals at a restaurant—I guess because I want us, collectively, to sample as many offerings as possible or to have the “full” experience? In the past, I have been know to override my own desire to order a particular thing because my husband already decided to order it, and I have wound up disappointed both in my second choice and for having missed out on what I really wanted. So that’s a weird food rule I just realized and want to unpack…
Yes! We don't question this at restaurants but at home, there's this expectation of sameness. Which makes sense from a labor perspective for sure, but not if it's making more work and stress for you.
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!
I literally just asked for those shoe laces for a holiday gift exchange! 🤞also wanted to add that everything you said here I think goes double for 2-year-olds who are generally too tired at dinner to eat any kind of challenging food. With my 3rd kid we’ve totally made peace with this and we’ll usually just supplement with toast or yogurt and there are so many fewer arguments at dinner! It is so much more pleasant for everyone!!