I love love LOVE books, but I recently realized how much money I was spending on books on Kindle that...were just sitting there for someday. And they weren't even like, sitting in piles making me feel like I was living in a magical used bookstore, they were on my Kindle just getting lost!
So I finally got a local library card and downloaded Libby and it's AWESOME. I put in a lot of holds. Sometimes I get them and read them, and sometimes it's not time, and I reschedule them, and it's fine! I get excited by the things i have on hold, and when they're available it's a happy free present to myself! AND it comes with the satisfaction of knowing I'm supporting my local library (they benefit from people with library cards, so get one even if you won't use it!). It scratches the shopping itch really really well. I can go after something on my want to read list, or browse and find something neat.
It's especially good because if I start something and don't like it, I can just return it and not feel guilty I wasted $12 on a steampunk novel that turned out to be full of literary devices that irritate me (ahem, for example, ahem, looking at the novel I started last night I definitely wasted money on). It's teaching me to DNF and that's something I should definitely do more of.
This was a great conversation. Re the hair brushes: My previous therapist referred to this type of thing as “setting fires so you can put them out” and, wow, did I feel very attacked! She described that pattern as a way of “binding” anxiety—basically encapsulating the anxiety in something else that can be neatly dealt with. I have found it an incredibly useful tool, not so much to change behavior but to name for myself what’s going on. For instance, am I currently making lists and doing a lot of thinking about the menu ifor my daughter’s graduation party that is *three* entire months away? Yes. And is that a way of dealing with the many many feelings I have about that milestone? TOTALLY.
I am SO glad you're having this conversation because it's been on my mind a lot in the past year. Previously, to try to be mindful about my purchases, I would put things on a wish list and try to spread them out over the coming months. If, by the time the assigned month came around and I still wanted the thing, then I would get it. And generally this worked for me. Then starting last spring, I was grappling with reinventing my style. This involves a much longer story including weight gain + embracing my shape and how I can rethink playing with my silhouette with fashion + the realization that a lot of my style and clothes I wore were inherited versions of myself and I really wanted to lean further into an identity that was a little bit punk but also breaks down notions of class and gender and also considers the environmental impact of my choices, while embracing that I'm a mom in my 40s, not a teen. (It's a whole thing.) So that required some more purchases than usual, but I was trying to still be mindful and buy secondhand where possible. But then last fall, I hit some stress points and in coping with the stress *and* post-stress relief, I went into kind of a shopping frenzy. I still bought things carefully in the sense that I had really honed my style so there was no purchase I regretted, and I'm not breaking the bank or anything. But I really did not love that I had this real *compulsion* to buy. It definitely had the same feelings like bingeing. So then I tried to go on a shopping "diet" and not buy anything non-essential for two months. That made me want to buy even more and I could totally see how that was like how dieting restrictions make you want to binge. Sometimes shopping and eating fulfill some kind of need that need some awareness about them, but trying to diet isn't the way either.
I've since kind of leveled back out, and I've been using my journal to try to work out what's going on inside. But long story short, I can definitely see parallels between shopping and dieting restrictions, and also how what we consume in food or in other stuff is also really wrapped up in identity and what we want our choices to say about who we are, so it's actually really hard to make these things value or morally neutral.
One last note: I'm currently living in Germany, and here they make you empty & rinse out all the food packaging to separate out food waste versus plastic versus glass, paper, etc. Plus kitchen and fridges are tiny, so you really have to keep on top of getting rid of stuff. It really makes you confront just how much you're throwing away and this makes me feel so guilty every time and/but also mad at how difficult it can be to buy food in portion sizes that actually make sense for our family's needs. And that's another form of placing the guilt burden on the individual when those are systemic choices. [ETA: and how many of those systemic choices deliberately seek to particularly benefit the nuclear family of 2 adults with 2.5 kids]
This is such a good discussion! I stopped buying new clothes all together a few years ago (with a few caveats -- underwear, tights, occasionally shoes, etc) and it's been a lot easier than I thought. I still SHOP, just on used clothing sites and thrift stores, but it's been helpful for me. If I want something new, I'll set an alert for it on ThredUp or Poshmark to see when it comes in. I'm trying to even curb that, because I am still spending too much and the shipping etc is not great for sustainability, but it was a lot easier than I thought to divest from buying anything new. Obviously this gets harder if you have a more unavailable size (I am small fat), and I understand that privilege. I also have a daughter and get all of her clothes used as well. I used to fall more prey to the "no ethical consumption under capitalism" thing as an excuse to buy whatever, and while that's still true, I can't handle contributing so much to waste at this point.
What an absolutely fantastic episode and incredibly timely for me! I'm about three weeks into my Marie Kondo Tidying Festival and it's amazing the way it reworks how you think about your belongings.
The part in the podcast about backstock of toilet paper and skin care products really made think about how an essential piece of the Konmari Method is to gather ALL of your like-items together so that you can see the sheer amount that you own. It's honestly flabbergasting even if you're someone who is decent at discarding things!
What I like about the Konmari Method and much of this podcast is that it's not about "minimalism" which has become associated with moral value and trendiness. Instead, it's about intentially inviting things into your space that make you happy and that you enjoy seeing/doing/eating/etc.
Lastly, I'll say that just by the nature of embarking on the tidying festival, I realized that it's *okay* to have a few meals that I love (most are pasta-based) that I continuously cycle through and to buy food ONLY for those meals, not whatever the hottest new item or things I feel like I "should" like and want to cook. So now my grocery list is pretty much always the same unless I decide to take on a meal as an "experiment" to see if it should join the rotation. And wow has it made all the difference for me.
Anyway, FANTASTIC listen (which I sent to numerous friends because wow, it really got me thinking). Thank you both!!!!!
I had to face my overconsumption when we moved from USA to the EU. Weighing “is it cheaper to buy it again than to ship it overseas?” was such a chore. We sold, donated, threw out (those choices were the most shame-inducing) 2/3 of our stuff and we still have TOO MUCH STUFF. It shifted my perspective on consumption pretty dramatically. Now when I decide on a purchase I ask myself “would I want to pay to ship this back across the Atlantic?”. The answer is usually no
I just finished shopping my tea collection until it was entirely gone!
I realized that I thought I always needed to have a bunch of kind of teas on hand at all times to offer someone who was visiting...but, like, maybe I've offered said collection to two people in total ever and had the vision of that transaction actually play out.
Now that my tea collection is empty, I'm excited to consider what teas I actually want to have and then use them up and repeat.
Consumerism is SUCH a fraught topic! It's probably impossible to talk about it without veering into restriction, and in our current reality, we're kind of stuck with finding that line for ourselves.
I'm frustrated that attempts to address personal consumption so often start with restriction and elimination — like a buy-nothing month or a Whole 30 diet. We tend to approach this with figuring out what we can live without, which inevitably calls up a diet mentality. It's worth asking why there's no trend of buy-everything months, or, like a "buy everything red I see for a month" — those weird exercises would equally jolt you out of your normal routines and prompt you to ask questions about your consumption habits. And, of course, just like Christyna said, put the responsibility back on the system as much we can — these are not our individual problems to solve!
Pantry trades are great! My local Buy Nothing group also has a lot of folks giving away food items. I actually used it to clear out some of the weird diet culture crap I was never going to use. I also bought French lentils because I got sucked in by a recipe that sounded amazing and realized that nope, I don't like them at all but other people do and they could use them up!
For toilet paper hoarding, that falls into the category of: if I have space to store this, it doesn't matter how much I have because it will definitely be used (I'll never not need to wipe!) and it does not "go bad" before I can get through it." But there are only a few consumables that are in that category, of course!
It may have already been said, but I came here to mention that if you have food in your pantry that hasn't been opened and you're not using it, you could also liberate it by donating it to a local food bank/donation program, or local program that teaches (anti- diet culture obviously ) cooking classes etc. Additionally women's shelters, youth support centres and the like often receive donations of food, unused toiletries, extra hygiene items, etc. etc. Just PLEASE PLEASE make sure it's not all expired, because then they just have to throw your trash out for you.
One thing I often think of is an article I read long ago, probably 15 or more years at this point. A reporter from the US went to report on labor organizing in garment factories in Central America, and he was shocked to see the workers who were fighting for better conditions were also, like, wearing Nike shoes. Their response was basically that it was more important to put time and energy into organizing than to make the (non existent) perfect consumer choice. It’s so easy to get obsessive about our own choices, which is of course where we have most control, but it’s much more effective to work toward broader social change.
"Maybe they need to do a little Ariel and brush with a fork." I snort-laughed at this 🤣
There were so many good tidbits of advice and inspiration in this. I'm inspired to make lunch with that box of couscous that's been in the back of my pantry for who knows how long.
Oh my gosh. I laughed out loud at the kohlrabi. I had this problem and had to quit a CSA because of it too. I managed to find a much smaller one that I go in person to (privileged to be able to do that) and you do not take what you won't use. They always have extras of something they got more of than planned (like squash) you can take, and they have u pick greens and herbs and flowers, so it was a much better deal and so much less waste and it makes me so happy to go there.
I see a lot of people here agreeing with hairbrush story and like... I get where Christyna was coming from AND I am responsible for making sure my kid's hair is brush (a least not painfully knotty). As a teacher I would notice a change in a kid's hair after several days. I really really get where she is coming from but like somethings like the brushes or for me having an extra laundry basket in my kitchen makes sense to me.
I have enough baskets! My kid's hair stuff is in a nice cardboard box that something shipped in and I think the fact I have combs all over my house is super helpful. I think this can be both.
I thought this was an interesting conversation. I see shopping as a really pleasurable activity, so am loathe to restrict it arbitrarily (much like with food). However, it’s easy to feel the burden of overconsumerism, so I would say it’s such a balancing act. What I will suggest as a reframe of the hairbrushes is as follows (and this is more from a finance perspective). This is inventory with an infinite or near infinite shelf life. And if storage costs are not high (as in, you have enough space) and the benefit of lower conflict is there, then perfect, have the hairbrushes. On the judgment of other parents…yeah maybe but honestly they see your kids so little really it’s highly unlikely they are paying attention! In my job hair appearance we would term nonmaterial information; it doesn’t convey anything about a kid unless there are lot of more serious issues teachers are worried about and then hair could be part of a framework / pattern on behavior.
For me anyway, it’s youth goggles. We live my the beach, we have a pool, and my kids are competitive swimmers. 2 years ago I started buying 10-12 pairs of goggles at a time and we have never since faced a goggle shortage. In fact I would say our wealth of goggles (we have a coat stand only for goggles) has actually improved loss as the goggles have a quite obvious home!
This is my favorite conversation you’ve had so far this year — I can’t begin to tell you how much I gleamed from reading this one piece. When you tie food, self-esteem and moralism back to consumerism, it resonates with me in a big way and makes me reconsider a lot of things, and not just salad dressing! (But definitely salad dressing, too!)
I love love LOVE books, but I recently realized how much money I was spending on books on Kindle that...were just sitting there for someday. And they weren't even like, sitting in piles making me feel like I was living in a magical used bookstore, they were on my Kindle just getting lost!
So I finally got a local library card and downloaded Libby and it's AWESOME. I put in a lot of holds. Sometimes I get them and read them, and sometimes it's not time, and I reschedule them, and it's fine! I get excited by the things i have on hold, and when they're available it's a happy free present to myself! AND it comes with the satisfaction of knowing I'm supporting my local library (they benefit from people with library cards, so get one even if you won't use it!). It scratches the shopping itch really really well. I can go after something on my want to read list, or browse and find something neat.
It's especially good because if I start something and don't like it, I can just return it and not feel guilty I wasted $12 on a steampunk novel that turned out to be full of literary devices that irritate me (ahem, for example, ahem, looking at the novel I started last night I definitely wasted money on). It's teaching me to DNF and that's something I should definitely do more of.
This was a great conversation. Re the hair brushes: My previous therapist referred to this type of thing as “setting fires so you can put them out” and, wow, did I feel very attacked! She described that pattern as a way of “binding” anxiety—basically encapsulating the anxiety in something else that can be neatly dealt with. I have found it an incredibly useful tool, not so much to change behavior but to name for myself what’s going on. For instance, am I currently making lists and doing a lot of thinking about the menu ifor my daughter’s graduation party that is *three* entire months away? Yes. And is that a way of dealing with the many many feelings I have about that milestone? TOTALLY.
I am SO glad you're having this conversation because it's been on my mind a lot in the past year. Previously, to try to be mindful about my purchases, I would put things on a wish list and try to spread them out over the coming months. If, by the time the assigned month came around and I still wanted the thing, then I would get it. And generally this worked for me. Then starting last spring, I was grappling with reinventing my style. This involves a much longer story including weight gain + embracing my shape and how I can rethink playing with my silhouette with fashion + the realization that a lot of my style and clothes I wore were inherited versions of myself and I really wanted to lean further into an identity that was a little bit punk but also breaks down notions of class and gender and also considers the environmental impact of my choices, while embracing that I'm a mom in my 40s, not a teen. (It's a whole thing.) So that required some more purchases than usual, but I was trying to still be mindful and buy secondhand where possible. But then last fall, I hit some stress points and in coping with the stress *and* post-stress relief, I went into kind of a shopping frenzy. I still bought things carefully in the sense that I had really honed my style so there was no purchase I regretted, and I'm not breaking the bank or anything. But I really did not love that I had this real *compulsion* to buy. It definitely had the same feelings like bingeing. So then I tried to go on a shopping "diet" and not buy anything non-essential for two months. That made me want to buy even more and I could totally see how that was like how dieting restrictions make you want to binge. Sometimes shopping and eating fulfill some kind of need that need some awareness about them, but trying to diet isn't the way either.
I've since kind of leveled back out, and I've been using my journal to try to work out what's going on inside. But long story short, I can definitely see parallels between shopping and dieting restrictions, and also how what we consume in food or in other stuff is also really wrapped up in identity and what we want our choices to say about who we are, so it's actually really hard to make these things value or morally neutral.
One last note: I'm currently living in Germany, and here they make you empty & rinse out all the food packaging to separate out food waste versus plastic versus glass, paper, etc. Plus kitchen and fridges are tiny, so you really have to keep on top of getting rid of stuff. It really makes you confront just how much you're throwing away and this makes me feel so guilty every time and/but also mad at how difficult it can be to buy food in portion sizes that actually make sense for our family's needs. And that's another form of placing the guilt burden on the individual when those are systemic choices. [ETA: and how many of those systemic choices deliberately seek to particularly benefit the nuclear family of 2 adults with 2.5 kids]
This is such a good discussion! I stopped buying new clothes all together a few years ago (with a few caveats -- underwear, tights, occasionally shoes, etc) and it's been a lot easier than I thought. I still SHOP, just on used clothing sites and thrift stores, but it's been helpful for me. If I want something new, I'll set an alert for it on ThredUp or Poshmark to see when it comes in. I'm trying to even curb that, because I am still spending too much and the shipping etc is not great for sustainability, but it was a lot easier than I thought to divest from buying anything new. Obviously this gets harder if you have a more unavailable size (I am small fat), and I understand that privilege. I also have a daughter and get all of her clothes used as well. I used to fall more prey to the "no ethical consumption under capitalism" thing as an excuse to buy whatever, and while that's still true, I can't handle contributing so much to waste at this point.
What an absolutely fantastic episode and incredibly timely for me! I'm about three weeks into my Marie Kondo Tidying Festival and it's amazing the way it reworks how you think about your belongings.
The part in the podcast about backstock of toilet paper and skin care products really made think about how an essential piece of the Konmari Method is to gather ALL of your like-items together so that you can see the sheer amount that you own. It's honestly flabbergasting even if you're someone who is decent at discarding things!
What I like about the Konmari Method and much of this podcast is that it's not about "minimalism" which has become associated with moral value and trendiness. Instead, it's about intentially inviting things into your space that make you happy and that you enjoy seeing/doing/eating/etc.
Lastly, I'll say that just by the nature of embarking on the tidying festival, I realized that it's *okay* to have a few meals that I love (most are pasta-based) that I continuously cycle through and to buy food ONLY for those meals, not whatever the hottest new item or things I feel like I "should" like and want to cook. So now my grocery list is pretty much always the same unless I decide to take on a meal as an "experiment" to see if it should join the rotation. And wow has it made all the difference for me.
Anyway, FANTASTIC listen (which I sent to numerous friends because wow, it really got me thinking). Thank you both!!!!!
I had to face my overconsumption when we moved from USA to the EU. Weighing “is it cheaper to buy it again than to ship it overseas?” was such a chore. We sold, donated, threw out (those choices were the most shame-inducing) 2/3 of our stuff and we still have TOO MUCH STUFF. It shifted my perspective on consumption pretty dramatically. Now when I decide on a purchase I ask myself “would I want to pay to ship this back across the Atlantic?”. The answer is usually no
I just finished shopping my tea collection until it was entirely gone!
I realized that I thought I always needed to have a bunch of kind of teas on hand at all times to offer someone who was visiting...but, like, maybe I've offered said collection to two people in total ever and had the vision of that transaction actually play out.
Now that my tea collection is empty, I'm excited to consider what teas I actually want to have and then use them up and repeat.
Consumerism is SUCH a fraught topic! It's probably impossible to talk about it without veering into restriction, and in our current reality, we're kind of stuck with finding that line for ourselves.
I'm frustrated that attempts to address personal consumption so often start with restriction and elimination — like a buy-nothing month or a Whole 30 diet. We tend to approach this with figuring out what we can live without, which inevitably calls up a diet mentality. It's worth asking why there's no trend of buy-everything months, or, like a "buy everything red I see for a month" — those weird exercises would equally jolt you out of your normal routines and prompt you to ask questions about your consumption habits. And, of course, just like Christyna said, put the responsibility back on the system as much we can — these are not our individual problems to solve!
Pantry trades are great! My local Buy Nothing group also has a lot of folks giving away food items. I actually used it to clear out some of the weird diet culture crap I was never going to use. I also bought French lentils because I got sucked in by a recipe that sounded amazing and realized that nope, I don't like them at all but other people do and they could use them up!
For toilet paper hoarding, that falls into the category of: if I have space to store this, it doesn't matter how much I have because it will definitely be used (I'll never not need to wipe!) and it does not "go bad" before I can get through it." But there are only a few consumables that are in that category, of course!
It may have already been said, but I came here to mention that if you have food in your pantry that hasn't been opened and you're not using it, you could also liberate it by donating it to a local food bank/donation program, or local program that teaches (anti- diet culture obviously ) cooking classes etc. Additionally women's shelters, youth support centres and the like often receive donations of food, unused toiletries, extra hygiene items, etc. etc. Just PLEASE PLEASE make sure it's not all expired, because then they just have to throw your trash out for you.
The hairbrush story is extremely relatable!
One thing I often think of is an article I read long ago, probably 15 or more years at this point. A reporter from the US went to report on labor organizing in garment factories in Central America, and he was shocked to see the workers who were fighting for better conditions were also, like, wearing Nike shoes. Their response was basically that it was more important to put time and energy into organizing than to make the (non existent) perfect consumer choice. It’s so easy to get obsessive about our own choices, which is of course where we have most control, but it’s much more effective to work toward broader social change.
"Maybe they need to do a little Ariel and brush with a fork." I snort-laughed at this 🤣
There were so many good tidbits of advice and inspiration in this. I'm inspired to make lunch with that box of couscous that's been in the back of my pantry for who knows how long.
Oh my gosh. I laughed out loud at the kohlrabi. I had this problem and had to quit a CSA because of it too. I managed to find a much smaller one that I go in person to (privileged to be able to do that) and you do not take what you won't use. They always have extras of something they got more of than planned (like squash) you can take, and they have u pick greens and herbs and flowers, so it was a much better deal and so much less waste and it makes me so happy to go there.
I see a lot of people here agreeing with hairbrush story and like... I get where Christyna was coming from AND I am responsible for making sure my kid's hair is brush (a least not painfully knotty). As a teacher I would notice a change in a kid's hair after several days. I really really get where she is coming from but like somethings like the brushes or for me having an extra laundry basket in my kitchen makes sense to me.
I have enough baskets! My kid's hair stuff is in a nice cardboard box that something shipped in and I think the fact I have combs all over my house is super helpful. I think this can be both.
I thought this was an interesting conversation. I see shopping as a really pleasurable activity, so am loathe to restrict it arbitrarily (much like with food). However, it’s easy to feel the burden of overconsumerism, so I would say it’s such a balancing act. What I will suggest as a reframe of the hairbrushes is as follows (and this is more from a finance perspective). This is inventory with an infinite or near infinite shelf life. And if storage costs are not high (as in, you have enough space) and the benefit of lower conflict is there, then perfect, have the hairbrushes. On the judgment of other parents…yeah maybe but honestly they see your kids so little really it’s highly unlikely they are paying attention! In my job hair appearance we would term nonmaterial information; it doesn’t convey anything about a kid unless there are lot of more serious issues teachers are worried about and then hair could be part of a framework / pattern on behavior.
For me anyway, it’s youth goggles. We live my the beach, we have a pool, and my kids are competitive swimmers. 2 years ago I started buying 10-12 pairs of goggles at a time and we have never since faced a goggle shortage. In fact I would say our wealth of goggles (we have a coat stand only for goggles) has actually improved loss as the goggles have a quite obvious home!
This is my favorite conversation you’ve had so far this year — I can’t begin to tell you how much I gleamed from reading this one piece. When you tie food, self-esteem and moralism back to consumerism, it resonates with me in a big way and makes me reconsider a lot of things, and not just salad dressing! (But definitely salad dressing, too!)